La ciencia llega a España: Goyescas

Started by Todd, September 26, 2024, 04:14:02 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Kalevala

#80
Quote from: Todd on October 26, 2024, 10:55:57 AMShe made four studio recordings.  This was cited in the RCA recording summary.
Thanks for the info.  On your thread?  If so, sorry, but I missed it.  Ah, I found it. :)

K

Todd



#5

I have been aware of José Menor's recording since it was issued, but I did not get around to it until now.  That was an egregious error on my part.  For, you see, Menor plays to the manner born, and one need only wait for about three seconds to figure that out.  His overall timing is just a bit slower than normal, but this is a recording where tempo basically doesn't matter as it just melts into the background.  His transitions between passages are impeccable, his rubato perfect, his dynamic shifts without flaw, and his rhythmic sense so very Spanish.  He plays with oodles upon oodles of flexibility.  What Menor achieves through his playing is programmatic music making that would work wonders in Liszt or Mussorgsky, and it fits each piece perfectly here.  I mean, the passion in the window conversation; the exuberance of the Fandango; the languid yet intense complaint with the Nightingale singing to match Liszt's evocation of St Francis' birds or anything by Messiaen; the intense El Amor y la Muerte that has all the potency of a Wagnerian love-death in one-tenth the time: what's not to love here?  Great stuff.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

ritter

Quote from: Todd on October 27, 2024, 04:47:32 AM

#5

I have been aware of José Menor's recording since it was issued, but I did not get around to it until now.  That was an egregious error on my part.  For, you see, Menor plays to the manner born, and one need only wait for about three seconds to figure that out.  His overall timing is just a bit slower than normal, but this is a recording where tempo basically doesn't matter as it just melts into the background.  His transitions between passages are impeccable, his rubato perfect, his dynamic shifts without flaw, and his rhythmic sense so very Spanish.  He plays with oodles upon oodles of flexibility.  What Menor achieves through his playing is programmatic music making that would work wonders in Liszt or Mussorgsky, and it fits each piece perfectly here.  I mean, the passion in the window conversation; the exuberance of the Fandango; the languid yet intense complaint with the Nightingale singing to match Liszt's evocation of St Francis' birds or anything by Messiaen; the intense El Amor y la Muerte that has all the potency of a Wagnerian love-death in one-tenth the time: what's not to love here?  Great stuff.
Indeed, great stuff (and the fillers on the CD are also very interesting).

I bought José Menor's recording last month, and found it very enjoyable (even more so after the disappointment of Aldo Ciccolini's recording of Goyescas —which unsurprisingly didn't do very well in this scientific ranking  ;) ).

Todd

Quote from: ritter on October 27, 2024, 07:13:07 AMI bought José Menor's recording last month, and found it very enjoyable (even more so after the disappointment of Aldo Ciccolini's recording of Goyescas —which unsurprisingly didn't do very well in this scientific ranking  ;) ).

After listening, I immediately and necessarily scrambled to see what other recordings Menor has made, and there are few, and nothing else by famous composers.  The Joan Guinjoan recordings may just end up in my listening queue at some point.  Several pianists in the top ten have made few recordings.  Who knows what that means?
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Todd



#4

Alicia de Larrocha's second recording for Hispavox is her fastest take, and it's in early-ish, not so great (ie, poor) stereo sound.  Everything else about it is unambiguously great.  It retains the fluidity of the mono Decca recording, and it infuses additional energy and an even freer sound to rhythm and rubato.  Though the recorded sound sounds harsh in loud passages, one gets a good sense of Larrocha's range in Coloquio en la reja, which both whispers and roars, and undulates between volume extremes and tempo extremes with silly ease.  The Fandango bursts with energy and Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor sometimes just plain shimmers.  El Amor y la Muerte is like Shakesperean tragedy spread across the ivory, and the Epilogue pops.  There's no denying the greatness of this recording, and all one has to do is accept the Spanish Piano Music curse, wherein some of the greatest recordings of Spanish keyboard music are in crap sound.  There's this, most of the rest of Larrocha's Hispavox recordings, pretty much everything Esteban Sanchez recorded, and Frederick Marvin's Soler, to name some of the most prominent examples. 
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Dry Brett Kavanaugh

Quote from: Todd on October 28, 2024, 04:26:08 AM

#4

Alicia de Larrocha's second recording for Hispavox is her fastest take, and it's in early-ish, not so great (ie, poor) stereo sound.  Everything else about it is unambiguously great.  It retains the fluidity of the mono Decca recording, and it infuses additional energy and an even freer sound to rhythm and rubato.  Though the recorded sound sounds harsh in loud passages, one gets a good sense of Larrocha's range in Coloquio en la reja, which both whispers and roars, and undulates between volume extremes and tempo extremes with silly ease.  The Fandango bursts with energy and Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor sometimes just plain shimmers.  El Amor y la Muerte is like Shakesperean tragedy spread across the ivory, and the Epilogue pops.  There's no denying the greatness of this recording, and all one has to do is accept the Spanish Piano Music curse, wherein some of the greatest recordings of Spanish keyboard music are in crap sound.  There's this, most of the rest of Larrocha's Hispavox recordings, pretty much everything Esteban Sanchez recorded, and Frederick Marvin's Soler, to name some of the most prominent examples. 



As you ladies and gents already know, this recording has been reissued from EMI.







Dry Brett Kavanaugh

#86
Quote from: Todd on October 26, 2024, 03:54:13 AM

#6

Alicia de Larrocha's first recording, on Decca, from 1955, is the slowest overall take of her four studio recordings, but it never sounds slow or even slower.  Indeed, the final RCA recording, though quicker in timing sounds and feels slower than this one.  That is down to flexibility.  By that I mean Laroccha effortlessly moves between faster and slower music with perfect transitions, plays with spicier rubato, and when she does play some of the slower music slower than in later versions, there's a musical tension that seems to dissipate with the decades.  While one hears it in the opener, it becomes clearer in Coloquio en la reja, which despite sometimes sparse pedaling, just hangs there, as radiant musical perfume.  The Fandango has fantastic energy and intensity and verve, while Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor has a fantastical air to it.  El Amor y la Muerte has more of that enchanting, effortless back and forth between almost dreamy slowness and biting fieriness and passion, and a drawn out, exhausted coda.  Here, the Epilogue has a loosey goosey, almost unstable feel, though it's obviously expertly delivered.  The effect compels.  Younger Larrocha could deliver.


This is a significant performance. This recording, along with her Hispavox in the early 60s (now issued from EMI) and Escandón, is my personal favorite. I guess Larrocha 2nd is technically a "better" (and more flamboyant) performance than this recording. But I slightly prefer this recording to the Hispavox gig because of the power, charisma, jubilation and spontaneity. I think her movement of motifs and melodies are often based on eighth note triplet or sixteenth note, implicitly or explicitly, and I imagine that's why the overall tempo is numerically slow.  But her movement and music are not slow. The same thing applies to Escandon too. While the execution is sophisticated, this is the music in tabernas. The performance proffers the Spanish aesthetics. Larrocha 2nd is a little formal and (nicely) calculated, and it is a music in a national museum.

Todd



#3

Javier Perianes is one of three pianists in this group to bring the work in at over an hour, and as such that means that there's ample slow playing.  Mr Perianes brings the tonal beauty and variegation throughout.  His take on Los requiebros comes in at 10'20", which is quite a bit longer than any other in this survey, and it more or less establishes the trajectory.  There can be no doubt of Perianes' virtuosic bone fides, and when he needs to rev and up and crank up the volume, as in the coda, he does, but that's not what he's about.  Pretty much everywhere, all the time, he's more concerned about eking out the subtlest of tonal shading and dynamic nuance.  It's like a sonic smorgasbord in that respect.  If anything, Coloquio en la reja offers even more of the same.  Truth to tell, it is possible to detect a hint of predictability in his style.  The same can be said of, say, Arcadi Volodos' Brahms and Schubert recordings, but predictable perfection is still perfection.  See, now, slower sometimes means the rhythmic aspect of the playing gets short shrift, but not so with Perianes, and the Fandango brings that home.  Sure, it's slower than average, but it flows just right, it has enough vigor, enough brio.  And of course, Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor runs the risk of sounding too beautiful.  What a terrible fate that would be, amiright?  Those trills at the end, man, they make it seem like Perianes could directly rival Yamane in Op 111 if he so chose.  One wants him to choose to do so!    El Amor y la Muerte again mixes oodles 'o oomph where needed, and drawn out delicate playing expertly, imparting overt passion and introspection with the best of them.  And the Epilogue mixes the fast and slow styles so well, that one just wants it to keep going.  Great, great stuff.

Not all is without flaw here.  Pedaling is audible in many places.  There, there's the beef.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Brian

Sounds like we have just Jorge Luis Prats and Michel Block left, although I guess there could be a real surprise lurking. Excited to test drive Perianes and the real surprise, José Menor.

Todd

Quote from: Brian on October 29, 2024, 06:17:49 AMExcited to test drive Perianes and the real surprise, José Menor.

Menor and Battersby were two out of left field recordings in the top ten.  I went in with no expectations with the former and low expectations with the latter and was wowed by both.  A few pianists offered just a bit more wow.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Brian

Did you sample some of the other recordings that did not make the final bracket and conclude based on samples that they didn't have anything unusual/special going on? I guess what I'm asking is how you decided to include José Menor and not, I dunno, Joop Celis*...seems like sample clips could have been a help.

*chosen for his funny name

Todd

Quote from: Brian on October 29, 2024, 06:35:33 AMDid you sample some of the other recordings that did not make the final bracket and conclude based on samples that they didn't have anything unusual/special going on? I guess what I'm asking is how you decided to include José Menor and not, I dunno, Joop Celis*...seems like sample clips could have been a help.

*chosen for his funny name

I combined the rigorous science of numerology, which resulted in the optimal number of thirty-six recordings, and strict sociolinguistic analysis which precluded including Joop among others, with streaming availability to determine which lesser-known recordings to include.  I find sampling a wholly unsatisfactory approach for recording inclusion determination since I invariably sample entire recordings, which would obviate the numerological mandate.  Or, I just cobbled together three dozen recordings and got on with it.  I can't remember which.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Todd



#2

Cuban pianist Jorge Luis Prats goes one better than Luis Fernando Pérez's adding in a movement by dropping the Epilogue altogether, moving El Amor y la Muerte to the end, and inserting El pelele as the fifth movement.  His justification for this jiggery-pokery is that the overall arc of the piece is about lovers who die, meaning an epilogue is meaningless.  One may find such explanations hokey, or whatever, but with playing like Prats', no justification is really needed. 

The opening note is a big, fat, bold blast at the audience in this live performance.  Then it's sort of off to the races, and Prats plays quickly throughout.  While he doesn't display the ultimate in tempo fluctuations, he certainly does fluctuate and does so fluidly.  Despite the heft and the speed, there's a sense of ease, as he just sort of free wheels the whole thing.  There's also a sense of romantic abandon.  This is true of-the-moment playing.  Individual details highlighted in some recordings get replaced by the sweep of the playing.  This is an anti-detail recording.  To be sure, Prats is not sloppy or unnuanced, but everything feeds the larger goal of delivering an opera for the piano.  The Fandango finds Prats belting out the music, with the left hand prancing up and down the keyboard in electric style.  Finally, in Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor, he backs off a bit, softens up some, and oozes romanticism from every (presumably) sweat-drenched pore.  The inclusion of El Pelele, with its unabashed energy and upbeat sound does sound incongruous from a musical purist standpoint.  Purity is just plain boring though, and it ends up offering maximum contrast to the maximum heavyweight drama of El Amor y la Muerte.  Opening with bass notes that sound organ-like, the relative speed of the take imparts more passion and fervor to the music, with romantic intensity to rival zippy takes of the most passionate music from Tristan, that apogee of love-death music.  Prats's vision of the music is clear and fully satisfying.  A humdinger, this.  (And it sounds like one poor string on the piano could take no more.) 

Ever since I first heard this blockbuster recital disc, it has been a favorite, and it's a shame that Prats doesn't really seem to care much about making recordings.  I've heard his Rach and DSCH concertos, and they are very fine.  I hope that Eloquence one day reissues his DG debut recording with LvB Op 101, the Schumann Toccata, and Gaspard.  To quote Gob: Come on!
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Hobby

The Prats debut recording (and his Rachmaninov) are available on Qobuz.

Todd



El Número Uno

Magic man Michel Block prestidigtates his way right up to the top of the list.  This was not unexpected.  In many things he recorded, Block delivered either the best or one of the best versions, at least up until his late Guild recordings, where he started playing some music extraordinarily slowly.  Even those recordings are something special. 

Like Prats, Block's recording is taken from a live performance.  Also like Prats, there's a sense of freedom in the playing.  But there's also straight up magic.  Los requiebros, slower than average, sort of suspends time, which is a Block specialty.  One loses all sense of time.  Hell, space, too.  Individual notes take on near cosmic significance, until they disappear into the ether.   He plays speedily, too.  True, he's not as rock solid as Prats, let alone pristine studio takes, but this is a recreative experience.  As is Coloquio en la reja, which starts off like a languid, plush dream.  Block's overall timing is slightly swifter than normal, and he speeds up in faster passages, and he fudges a couple things, but the whole thing just washes over the listener.  This is how romantic piano playing is supposed to go.  The Fandango is one of the slower takes, and it sounds impossibly slow to open, yet Block holds it together.  As he speeds up, some of the playing takes on a nearly aggressive mien, but it all blends perfectly.  Then sheer artistic perfection comes in Quejas, o La Maja y el ruiseñor, where Block plays in a hushed, delicate, gentle, and sweet manner.  Unsweet is the thundering opening of El Amor y la Muerte, which is like a death throe, that gives way to exhausted whimpering, before another throe erupts.  Block is fairly quick in this movement, and while some passages sound zippy (and rough), it doesn't feel that way.  He distends the coda, dragging it out, rendering the most pathetic of love-deaths.  Mmmm, hmmm.  Block finishes off by playing the Epilogue in almost reckless fashion, going nutso fast in some passages, and playing with disturbed rhythm in places, and the piano sounds a bit the worse for wear here and there.  But the effect is quite something.  It's a giant musical treat, so appropriate on this day of all days.

This is it, this is the thing, it's real, it's of-the-moment, and this performance was fleeting and then just gone forever.  Lucky were the attendees, and lucky are listeners that microphones captured this event.  I saved this recording for last, with Prats and Perianes the two immediately preceding it, precisely because these three versions stand out in memory more than the others covered herein, with the great Mr Block the one I subconsciously think of when I think of this work.  This reminded me why.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Mandryka

#95
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen

Dry Brett Kavanaugh

Quote from: Mandryka on October 26, 2024, 06:31:59 AMWhen she plays notes fast, possibly in apeggiation, that's where I have a slight problem - it has a showy offy cocktail bar pianist vibe IMO - that's what I hear in Los Requierbos in fact. Afanassiev would never be like that!

This only struck me when I listened on my best system, the ESLs. When I first posted about her, I'd heard the CD on less revealing speakers.

Nevertheless I like the whole thing in fact, I guess I like cocktail bars.



Apparently she plays at venues other than cocktail bars.