The British Composers Thread

[vandermolen]

Colourised photos are almost always awful - this one is a case in point - RVW looks like a cadavar reanimated by an undertaker.

V funny LOL!

[calyptorhynchus]

To be released on January 3rd 2025:



- Three pieces for violin and piano
- Passacaglia for violin and viola
- Memory for cello and piano
- Piano Quartet
- Suite for cello and piano
- Elegy for cello and piano

Yet another composer I haven't heard any note of. Looks enticing.

I shall certainly have a listen. Finzi thought highly of his work, which is enough of a recommendation for me.

[relm1]

Any thoughts on David Matthew's Norkfolk March?  It is basically Vaughan Williams' Norfolk Rhapsody No. 3 which was lost but Matthews recreated it based on the same folk tunes using structure notes from the original.  I'm curious about it but it doesn't seem online other than this recording full of other restorations/completions.  My problem is they only offer it in CD format and I don't have a CD player so not able to hear it. 

https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=CDLX7351

[Roasted Swan]

Any thoughts on David Matthew's Norkfolk March?  It is basically Vaughan Williams' Norfolk Rhapsody No. 3 which was lost but Matthews recreated it based on the same folk tunes using structure notes from the original.  I'm curious about it but it doesn't seem online other than this recording full of other restorations/completions.  My problem is they only offer it in CD format and I don't have a CD player so not able to hear it. 

https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=CDLX7351

I bought this disc very recently and enjoyed it (the whole disc) a lot.  The Matthews is certainly enjoyable - but important to treat it as Matthews and NOT RVW!!  In fact the highlight of the disc for me was the Bluebird incidental music.  Something I had zero knowledge of previously.

As an aside - DUtton seem to have a digital death wish making their releases as unavailable as possible!  Their release schedule is chaotic and poorly advertised - such a shame that they are commercially so muddled given the artistic quality of their releases....

[Christo]

I bought this disc very recently and enjoyed it (the whole disc) a lot.  The Matthews is certainly enjoyable - but important to treat it as Matthews and NOT RVW!!  In fact the highlight of the disc for me was the Bluebird incidental music.  Something I had zero knowledge of previously.

Totally agree with both verdicts: The Bluebird music is the real find, the Norfolk March is very nice, but no RVW. Everything is surpassed BTW by the new CD with RVW's incidental music for Shakespeare plays.

[kyjo]

I bought this disc very recently and enjoyed it (the whole disc) a lot.  The Matthews is certainly enjoyable - but important to treat it as Matthews and NOT RVW!!  In fact the highlight of the disc for me was the Bluebird incidental music.  Something I had zero knowledge of previously.

As an aside - DUtton seem to have a digital death wish making their releases as unavailable as possible!  Their release schedule is chaotic and poorly advertised - such a shame that they are commercially so muddled given the artistic quality of their releases....

Re. Dutton - totally agreed. Not only are their discs prohibitively expensive (especially to have shipped to the US), but they're often unavailable for download and/or streaming (mostly their more recent releases). I've been itching to hear a lot of their recent releases but have no means of doing so...

[foxandpeng]

Re. Dutton - totally agreed. Not only are their discs prohibitively expensive (especially to have shipped to the US), but they're often unavailable for download and/or streaming (mostly their more recent releases). I've been itching to hear a lot of their recent releases but have no means of doing so...

Agreed. Bonkers.

[Roy Bland]

However IMHO Dutton has done unparalleled work for the English repertoire their merits outweigh their defects

[Roasted Swan]

However IMHO Dutton has done unparalleled work for the English repertoire their merits outweigh their defects

The quality of their product is not in doubt - but if it is hard to hear/buy/know about then that is a serious shortcoming and one which I suspect will lead to the label itself failing simply because it is not generating enough 'hard' sales and therefore income.  If there are any new releases (few and far between though they are these days!) that interest me on the label I tend to buy them straight away now because I am not sure how long they will last in the catalogue.  It does feel a bit like Dutton are sticking with 78's when the rest of the world has moved onto LP's.

[Irons]

The quality of their product is not in doubt - but if it is hard to hear/buy/know about then that is a serious shortcoming and one which I suspect will lead to the label itself failing simply because it is not generating enough 'hard' sales and therefore income.  If there are any new releases (few and far between though they are these days!) that interest me on the label I tend to buy them straight away now because I am not sure how long they will last in the catalogue.  It does feel a bit like Dutton are sticking with 78's when the rest of the world has moved onto LP's.

A Dutton sale is something else. Quite recent releases of interesting repertoire for peanuts. You have to get in quick though as I have noticed that enterprising eBayers purchasing sale items and then selling at full price and beyond on that platform. 

[Roasted Swan]

A Dutton sale is something else. Quite recent releases of interesting repertoire for peanuts. You have to get in quick though as I have noticed that enterprising eBayers purchasing sale items and then selling at full price and beyond on that platform. 

They have a sale at the moment but its very limited - just a selection of their SACD releases with 20% off.  It includes most of their remasterings of the RCA Classic Film Scores recordings - which are superb - but then not the SACD of the RCA Die Tote Stadt - which was almost an appendix to that series.  You are quite right though - in the past their sales have been full-price catalogue items very substantially reduced but not here.

[kyjo]

Recently I made the acquaintance with this delightful album of orchestral music by Cipriani Potter (1792-1871)



Potter was undoubtedly one of the most important English composers of the early Romantic period, as well as the nation's first significant symphonist (he composed no less than ten works in the form). The Symphony in C minor is an energetic, well-crafted work in a mildly sturm und drang style (think Schubert's 4th, for instance). But it is the Symphony in B-flat major which is the real prize here. This work completely exceeded by expectations and is full of inspired themes, imaginative orchestration, and an almost Rossinian sense of "operatic" wit. The two couplings are hardly less attractive. The Concertante on the Theme "Les follies d'Espagne" (aka "La Folia") is a delightful virtuoso jeu d'esprit with solo parts for piano, violin, cello and double bass(!). And The Tempest is an atmospheric and effective overture/tone poem that need not fear comparison with similar works like Mendelssohn's The Hebrides. On the basis of the music here, it's a pity that Potter virtually stopped composing in the late 1830s, well before his death in 1871. As ever, Howard Griffiths proves to be an ideally persuasive advocate of this music, imbuing it with lots of energy and characterization. Warmly recommended, especially for the Symphony in B-flat and The Tempest!

[calyptorhynchus]

I have a theory about Donald Tovey's Symphony, which I have aired on these pages before: this is that the finale is in fact the first movement and the first movement is in fact the finale.

The reason I came to this conclusion is when I first listened to the work when I bought the Toccata recording many moons ago was that that was what these two movements sounded like, respectively, and ever since then I have listened to the work with the movements in the order 4,2,3,1, and been convinced by this ordering.

I speculated that somehow the movements had been misplaced in the MS, but today I was ferreting around on line and found that there is a recording of the work from 1937 with Tovey conducting the Reid Symphony Orchestra (of course) (Symposium 1352) which by the track list indicates that he played the movements in the order 1-4. Damn, there goes a nice theory.

However, the work does sound better with my ordering of the movements... try it!

[relm1]

I have a theory about Donald Tovey's Symphony, which I have aired on these pages before: this is that the finale is in fact the first movement and the first movement is in fact the finale.

The reason I came to this conclusion is when I first listened to the work when I bought the Toccata recording many moons ago was that that was what these two movements sounded like, respectively, and ever since then I have listened to the work with the movements in the order 4,2,3,1, and been convinced by this ordering.

I speculated that somehow the movements had been misplaced in the MS, but today I was ferreting around on line and found that there is a recording of the work from 1937 with Tovey conducting the Reid Symphony Orchestra (of course) (Symposium 1352) which by the track list indicates that he played the movements in the order 1-4. Damn, there goes a nice theory.

However, the work does sound better with my ordering of the movements... try it!

Interesting idea but I quite like it when composers challenge conventional wisdom in their movement order.  Obvious example is Tchaikovsky Symphony No. 6 where the third movement is thought to be the finale.  How the composer handles the ending makes you re-evaluate what you thought you were hearing.

[Franco_Manitobain]

Recently completed my first full traversal through this 20 disc set. Highly enjoyable, and many standouts, which include Elgar's Piano Quintet, Britten's Simple Symphony, Bax's String Quartet No. 1 and Rubbra's String Quartet No. 2 just to name a few.

[Roasted Swan]

Recently completed my first full traversal through this 20 disc set. Highly enjoyable, and many standouts, which include Elgar's Piano Quintet, Britten's Simple Symphony, Bax's String Quartet No. 1 and Rubbra's String Quartet No. 2 just to name a few.

The Maggini's were wonderfully consistent and impressive guides to this repertoire.  This was a remarkably fine survey.

[vandermolen]

I have a theory about Donald Tovey's Symphony, which I have aired on these pages before: this is that the finale is in fact the first movement and the first movement is in fact the finale.

The reason I came to this conclusion is when I first listened to the work when I bought the Toccata recording many moons ago was that that was what these two movements sounded like, respectively, and ever since then I have listened to the work with the movements in the order 4,2,3,1, and been convinced by this ordering.

I speculated that somehow the movements had been misplaced in the MS, but today I was ferreting around on line and found that there is a recording of the work from 1937 with Tovey conducting the Reid Symphony Orchestra (of course) (Symposium 1352) which by the track list indicates that he played the movements in the order 1-4. Damn, there goes a nice theory.

However, the work does sound better with my ordering of the movements... try it!

Most interesting! I like Tovey's Symphony, especially when moments of great humanity and beauty emerge from the rather academic facade. Because of the baby mayhem currently going on in this family I have less time than usual to listen to my favourite composers. I expect that my stressed-out daughter would take a dim view of me opting out of Christmas domestic chores to listen to Sir Donald Tovey's Symphony whilst experimenting with the order of the movements! 

[kyjo]

Recently completed my first full traversal through this 20 disc set. Highly enjoyable, and many standouts, which include Elgar's Piano Quintet, Britten's Simple Symphony, Bax's String Quartet No. 1 and Rubbra's String Quartet No. 2 just to name a few.

Yep, that's a consistently great, dare I say indispensable set! So much fine music in uniformly convincing performances. It would be impossible for me to pick out just a few highlights!

[calyptorhynchus]

A bit older than most of the composers on this thread, but very good:



William Hayes (1708–1777) was an Oxford-based composer. His orchestral works (sinfonias and concerti grossi) are very good, and so too are his organ concertos.

If that disk whets your appetite, there's another coming out on Heritage in February.

[Albion]

Recently I made the acquaintance with this delightful album of orchestral music by Cipriani Potter (1792-1871)



Potter was undoubtedly one of the most important English composers of the early Romantic period, as well as the nation's first significant symphonist (he composed no less than ten works in the form). The Symphony in C minor is an energetic, well-crafted work in a mildly sturm und drang style (think Schubert's 4th, for instance). But it is the Symphony in B-flat major which is the real prize here. This work completely exceeded by expectations and is full of inspired themes, imaginative orchestration, and an almost Rossinian sense of "operatic" wit. The two couplings are hardly less attractive. The Concertante on the Theme "Les follies d'Espagne" (aka "La Folia") is a delightful virtuoso jeu d'esprit with solo parts for piano, violin, cello and double bass(!). And The Tempest is an atmospheric and effective overture/tone poem that need not fear comparison with similar works like Mendelssohn's The Hebrides. On the basis of the music here, it's a pity that Potter virtually stopped composing in the late 1830s, well before his death in 1871. As ever, Howard Griffiths proves to be an ideally persuasive advocate of this music, imbuing it with lots of energy and characterization. Warmly recommended, especially for the Symphony in B-flat and The Tempest!

Seconded! I contributed the work-list to Wikipedia with the clarification as to the chaotic numbering of the symphonies and have repeatedly encouraged Howard Griffiths to turn his initial recording into a full cycle. I'm glad that now it is well underway and will include other works such as the Overture in E minor (1815/ 1848), the overture "Antony and Cleopatra" (1835) and probably the piano concerto in E flat (1833) which was not recorded by Hyperion...