Bach Family

[ando]

Back to Wilhelm Friedemann; here's a fine performance of his Adagio & Fugue in D minor, F.65. allmusic.com's Joseph Stephenson provides a nice capsule review of the composition. The Yong Siew Toh Conservatory Ensemble-In-Residence performed the work live at their concert hall in Singapore on 18 February of 2023:

Incidentally, BC's now out-of-print Wilhelm Friedemann Edition is available for streaming on YouTube, Apple Music and Spotify.

[ando]

No one knows who in the Bach family wrote this one. But it was a delight to wake up to it this morning.

Sonata for Keyboard and Violin in G minor, H. 542.5 (presumably, CPE Bach)

[ando]

The Sons of Bach, Vol. 1: C.P.E. Bach Symphonies & Chamber Music
Cello – Reinhold Johannes Buhl
Composed By – Carl Philipp Emanuel Bach
Conductor – Günter Kehr
Flute – Klaus Pohlers
Harpsichord – Martin Galling
Orchestra – Mainzer Kammerorchester
Viola – Georg Schmid
Violin – Günter Kehr

[ando]

Sometimes I think that in the circles Johann Christian moved and the patronage he garnered, not desiring to make a false step often resulted in making rather predictable ones. Of course, this is the hindsight of centuries. Beautiful as his compositions often are they don't exactly challenge the listener.

J.C. Bach's famous Symphony No. 6 in G Minor

[ando]

At the opposite end, of course, is Wilhelm Friedemann, whose music offers little reward if you're not attentively listening -

Sinfonia (for strings) in F Major

[Florestan]

Sometimes I think that in the circles Johann Christian moved and the patronage he garnered, not desiring to make a false step often resulted in making rather predictable ones. Of course, this is the hindsight of centuries. Beautiful as his compositions often are they don't exactly challenge the listener.

J.C. Bach's famous Symphony No. 6 in G Minor

Why should music always challenge the listener? J. Chr. Bach was a pioneer and devotee of the style galant, whose aesthetics was about charming and moving the audience, not about challenging it. Is an unchallenging beauty less beautiful than a challenging one?

[ando]

Why should music always challenge the listener? J. Chr. Bach was a pioneer and devotee of the style galant, whose aesthetics was about charming and moving the audience, not about challenging it. Is an unchallenging beauty less beautiful than a challenging one?

Not at all. There's all kinds of ways to "move" a listener. I'll never suggest that music should "always" be anything - except interesting. Part of my point was to characterize one of the ways the music of J.C. differs from both C.PE. and W.F.; far from a dismissal. But his penchant to please audiences is clearly more evident than either of the other two.

[Florestan]

Not at all. There's all kinds of ways to "move" a listener. I'll never suggest that music should "always" be anything - except interesting. Part of my point was to characterize one of the ways the music of J.C. differs from both C.PE. and W.F.; far from a dismissal. But his penchant to please audiences is clearly more evident than either of the other two.

Thanks for clarifying. I agree, totally. Actually, CPE's and J.Chr.'s aesthetics and soundworld could not be more different, what with the inwardness of the former and the worldliness of the latter. I can't imagime J. Chr. writing the Wurttemberg Sonatas any more than I can imagine CPE writing the Vauxhall Songs. 

[ando]

FYI: The Bach Family Tree (from JS Bach's great grandfather, Veit Bach)

[ando]

No one's mentioned the music of Johann Christoph Frederick. I'm not sure where he stands among the sons of J. S. in terms of talent as I'm just discovering his work now. This well regarded Camerata Köln recording of J.C.F.'s Trio Sonata in E Minor is a nice place to begin.

[ando]

More on JCF Bach by pianist, Jermaine Sprosse -

on his new CD of keyboard works

interview on the JCF project.

Apple Music

[ando]

Came across this doc tracing the footsteps of J.S. in Thomaskirche, Leipzig with organist/conductor, Ton Koopman. Good one. The soundtrack is in Dutch, but the English captions are (unusually) good.

[SonicMan46]

Well, I'm about to go through my Johann Christian Bach (1735-1782) collection and wanted to post in a potential existing thread but could not find one dedicated solely to him - this recently created thread on the 'Bach Family' will be fine. Brief bio below (much more at the link).  In London, his fame was due to his opera works and to the famous Bach-Abel concerts. Unlike Handel who died a rich man, JC Bach who made similar career choices ended his young life (46 years old) in poverty (see last paragraph below).

JC Bach's list of compositions was cataloged by Ernest Warburton's as The Collected Works of Johann Christian Bach, and categorized as W... numbers. At present, I own just under 3 dozen discs of his works (much less than his elder half-brother CPE), so future posts will look at what I currently have and see additions are warranted, particularly in instrumental music.  Dave

Johann Christian Bach(September 5, 1735 – January 1, 1782) was a German composer of the Classical era, the youngest son of Johann Sebastian Bach. He received his early musical training from his father, and later from his half-brother, Carl Philipp Emanuel Bach in Berlin. After his time in Berlin he made his way to Italy to study with famous Padre Martini in Bologna. While in Italy, J.C. Bach was appointed as an organist at the Milan Cathedral. In 1762 he became a composer to the King's Theater in London where he wrote a number of successful Italian operas and became known as "The English Bach". He is responsible for the development of the sinfonia concertante form. He became one an influential figure of the classical period, influencing compositional styles of prolific musicians like Haydn and Mozart.

By the late 1770s, both his popularity and finances were in decline. By the time of Bach's death on New Year's Day 1782, he had become so indebted (in part due to his steward embezzling his money), that Queen Charlotte stepped in to cover the expenses of the estate and provided a life pension for Bach's widow. He was buried in the graveyard of St. Pancras Old Church, London (Source)

 

[SonicMan46]

According to the JC Bach catalog, the first category are 'Keyboard Works', W A1 - W A31 - the initial 12 are the Op. 5 & Op. 17 Sonatas (12 total works) - I own duplicate recordings w/ a mixture of instruments; in Op. 5, Bart van Oort on fortepiano & Sophie Yates on harpsichord - in Op. 17, van Oort returns on fortepiano and Alberto Nosè is on piano (reviews attached). Not sure much more recorded exists beyond Op. 17 although there are some 4-hand compositions? Any suggestions?  Dave



 

[JBS]

Ingrid Haebler recorded a bunch of JCB for Phillips, all on fortepiano: the Opus 5 sonatas, plus flute sonatas and keyboard concertos. I have them as part of the Decca Haebler set. On their own, the concertos are still available on CD, but the others seem to be only DL.

She seems to have recorded much more JCB than JSB.

[SonicMan46]

JC Bach's Chamber Music - in the Warburton's catalog, the second category are the chamber works, using the W B.. designation; a condensed version is shown below and amounts to about a 100 compositions, although instruments are often substituted, especially for the KB + violin sonatas, where a flute may be used (my example is Op. 16).

In my collection, I have just 6 CDs (one a MP3 DL burned to CD-R) which are shown at the bottom - plus the works are bolded in the listing with each recording listed in the footnote for those interested.  What I find amazing is how little of JC's chamber works (now I'll come later to 3 'big' boxes from other categories) are present - searching Amazon and several of the European websites, there does not seem to be a whole lot more?  So any suggestions would be appreciated - now there are several other recordings of Op. 16 (one on CPO alternating flute and violin but a poor review of the violinist; another with Spanyi on tangent piano but a poor review of the recorded sound).  Dave

JC Bach's Chamber Music
W B1 - Harp piece (lost)
W B2- W B6a - Sonata for KB & Violin, Op. 10 (5 works)
W B6b - Sonata for viola da gamba
W B7 - Sonata for KB & Violin, Op. 10, No. 6
W B8 - W B9 - Sonata for KB & Violin, Op. 15, No. 3/4 (2 works)
W B10 - W B15a - Sonata for KB & Violin, Op. 16 (6 works)*"
W B15a - Sonata for viola da gamba
W B16 - W B19 - Sonata for KB & Violin, Op. 18 (4 works)
W B20 - W B26 - Sonata for KB & Violin, No. 1-7 (7 works)
W B27 - Sonata for KB & Violin in A Major
W B28 - W B29 - Trio Sonatas (lost)
W B30 - W B35 - Trio Sonatas, Op. 2 (6 works)
W B36 - W B41 - Trio Sonatas, Op. 8 (6 works)
W B42 - Trio for 2 violins & cello
W B43 - W B46 - KB Trios, Op.2, No. 1-4 (4 works)#
W B47a - KB Trio in A Major (Milanese version)
W B47B - W B48 - KB Trios, Op. 2, No. 5/6 (2 works)#
W B49 - W B50 - KB Trios, Op. 15, No. 1/2 (2 works)#
W B51 - W B56 - Quartet, Op. 8, No. 1-6 (6 works)+
W B57 - W B59 - Flute Quartets (3 works)
W B60 - Quartet in B-flat Major
W B61 - W B64 - Quartets 2 flutes, Op. 19 (4 works)!
W B65 - Quartet 2 oboes (lost)
W B66 - W B69 - KB Quartet, 3 lost (4 works)
W B70 - W B75 - Quintet, Op.11, No. 1-6 (6 works)@
W B76 - W B77 - KB Quintet, Op. 22, No. 1/2 (2 works)
W B78 - Sextet for winds, KB, & strings C major
W B79 - W B82 - Military Quintet, No. 1-4 (4 works)
W B83 - W B93 - Marches (11 works)
W BInc1 - WBInc6 - Variety of pieces (6 works)
W BInc7 - W BInc12 - Symphony Winds, No. 1-6 (6 works)
  * Schenkman & Westcott, Op. 16 (fortepiano & flute)
  " Ruggeri & Uinskyte, Op. 16 (harpsichord & violin)
  + Arai et al, Op. 8 Quartets (oboe, violin, viola da gamba, cello)
  # Trio 1790, Op. 2 & 15 (harpsichord, violin, cello)
  ! Camerata Köln, Op. 19 (flutes, violin/viola, cello)
  @ Hunteler et al, Op. 11 (flute, oboe, violin, B.C.)

[DavidW]

You're probably not surprised but I like this recording!  I have a thing for piano trios, though I first listened to it because I loved Trio 1790s Haydn set.

[SonicMan46]

You're probably not surprised but I like this recording!  I have a thing for piano trios, though I first listened to it because I loved Trio 1790s Haydn set.

David - just looked through my database - own 15 discs of Trio 1790 (9 are in a Haydn box)!

For those looking at my previous post on JC Bach's Chamber Music, I missed a recording, first one below of the 'Six Wind Symphonies' (W BInc7 - W BInc12) w/ Eric Hoeprich on period clarinet along w/ 5 other performers on period clarinet, bassoons and horns.  Also was stimulated to obtain a few more recordings in his chamber category, so Discogs had a couple CDs of interest (next two below); Consortium Classicum doing the same 'Wind Symphonies' but on MIs; Pinnock adds a couple more missing from my collection, a Quintet & Sextet.  Dave

[SonicMan46]

JC Bach's Orchestral Music - in the Warburton's catalog, the third category are the orchestral works, using the W C.. designation; a condensed version is shown below and amounts to about a 100 compositions.  The easiest way to collect most of these works are the 3 CPO boxes (17 discs total) w/ Anthony Halstead and the Hanover Band, recorded between 1994-2001 - I've indicated in the footnote below the W C.. numbers included.  Dave

JC Bach's Orchestral Music (same link above)
W C1 - W C6 - Symphony, Op. 3, No. 1-6 (6 works)+
W C7a - Symphony, Op. 6, No. 1+
W C7b - Symphony in G Major+
W C8 - W C12 - Symphony, Op. 6, No. 2-6 (5 works)+
W C13 - W C15 - Symphony, Op. 8, No. 2-4 (3 works)+
W C16a - Symphony in C Major+
W C16b - Symphony in C Major
W C17a - Symphony in B-flat Major+
W C17b - Symphony, Op. 9, No. 1+
W C18a - Symphony in E-flat Major+
W C18b - Symphony, Op. 9, No. 2+
W C19 - Symphonie périodique
W C20 - W C25 - Symphony, Op. 12 (lost - 6 works)
W C26- W C28 - Symphony, Op. 18, No. 1,4,5 (3 works)+
W C29 - W C30 - Symphony & Overture a 6 (lost - 2 works)
W C31 - Symphony Double Orchestra (lost)
W C32 - W C48 - Concertants, various instruments (18 works)#
W C49 - W C54 - KB Concerto, Op. 1, No. 1-6 (6 works)*
W C55 - W C60a - KB Concerto, Op. 7,  No. 1-6 (6 works)*
W C60b - KB Concerto in G Major#
W C61 - KB Concerto, Op. 14 in E-flat Major*
W C62 - W C67 - KB Concerto, Op. 13, No. 1-6 (6 works)*
W C68 - W C73 - Harpsichord Concerto, No. 1-6 (6 works)*
W C74 - Concerto "nach Tartinis Manier" (lost)
W C75 - Piano Concerto in E-flat Major
W C76 - Violin Concerto in C Major#
W C78 - W C79 - Flute Concerto x 2 (2 works)
W C80 - W C81 - Oboe Concerto, No. 1/2 (2 works)
W C82 - W C83 - Bassoon Concerto x 2 (2 works)
W C84 - W C85 - Minuets Queens BD x 2 (2 works)
W CInc1 - W CInc4 - Symphony various keys (4 works)
W CInc5 - Concertante flute, violins, cello#
W CInc6 - Harpsichord Concerto in E Major
W CInc7 - Violin Concerto (lost)
W CInc8 - Flute Concerto in D Major (lost)
W CInc9 - Minuet in E-flat Major
  *Keyboard Concertos box
  +Symphonies box
  #Concertantes box

[Spenserian]

To me the best recordings of the symphonies must be those of Zinman with the Netherlands Chamber Orchestra, of Op. 6, 9 and 18, initially for Phillips and re-released on the Newton classics label, the CD I have. Halstead and the Hanover band have much, much broader tempi, The Netherlands Chamber Orchestra are a burst of energy in comparison. I first learned of these performances in a dictionary of sorts of conductors, in which this was singled out as Zinman's greatest achievement and as a recording of unusual energy. Highly recommended for fans of J.C. Bach, who I think wrote some wonderful music.

Incidentally, I have read Heinz Gartner's book on J.C. Bach ('John Christian Bach - Mozart's Friend and Mentor'), but that's very light on discussion of the music. Would love to get my hands on a copy of Charles Sanford Terry's earlier book on him, especially the updated second edition with editing and a foreword by C. Robbins Landon. In fact, may search for a copy right now!