Bach B Minor Mass with "small" chorus

[tomseeley]

I'd like suggestions please for a good recording of Bach's B Minor Mass with a fairly small chorus and orchestra.  I've got one by the Academy of St. Martin in the Fields, which is ok, but I'd like a version that lets me discern the choral parts a little more distinctly, if such exists!

And I'm not particularly fond of versions that use soloists on some of the choral parts, so "one voice per part" is too "small" IMO!

[dtwilbanks]

I remember enjoying Leonhardt's. I believe that was small.

[tomseeley]

Any other details, so I could maybe track it down?  Label, orchestra, date, etc?

[dtwilbanks]

http://www.bach-cantatas.com/Vocal/BWV232-Leonhardt.htm

[knight66]

Rifkin is your man here. He has produced a version where the entire piece is sung one to a part. It is excellent. A very different experience from the more usual concept, but it works splendidly on its own terms. Emma Kirkby is amongst the singers. It has been available on the Nonsuch label.

Incidentally, if you want the same treatment for the St Matthew Passion I cannot recommend too highly the McCreesh version on Archive. The drama is immediate and involving in a way I never imagined possible other than with a substantial body of singers.

Mike

[prémont]

Rifkin is your man here. He has produced a version where the entire piece is sung one to a part. It is excellent. A very different experience from the more usual concept, but it works splendidly on its own terms. Emma Kirkby is amongst the singers. It has been available on the Nonsuch label.

Did he record the mass twice? The recording, I own, is released by Erato using American singers and definitely not Emma Kirkby. I think it is OOP by now.

[knight66]

He must have done more than one version, I have not heard the 'other' one. It was regarded as wrongheaded at the time, but years later as can be seen, his ideas have been given respectability. It is easily the best version for clarifying the choral textures.

Mike

[KevinP]

He seems to have only recorded once, and without Emma Kirkby.
http://www.bach-cantatas.com/Vocal/BWV232-Rifkin.htm

Could your memory be playing tricks on you, Mike? Or do  you have some rare, maybe unofficial, recording?

[KevinP]

Ah, you're thinking of Parrott, aren't you? They both did 1VPP Masses in the early 80s. And Kirkby is on this one.

[KevinP]

I tend to prefer bigger forces here, historically inaccurate though it may be. My favourite 1VPP is the newest one, by the Netherlands Bach Society, available on SACD.

But, as Tom requested no 1VPP recordings, here are a few with slightly bigger forces. It's hard to know where to draw the line, however, as a small chorus performing this music 30 years ago might be monstrously huge today. (Case in point: Richter. He scaled down the chorus significantly from what proceeded him, but purists dismiss him as a dinosaur these days.) Basically, any modern recording is going to be either small or 1VPP. Avoid the few 1VPP ones and you're okay.

Helmut Muller-Bruhl, which is the second Naxos recording. (The first is not memorable.) Available as CD or SACD (and maybe DVD-A as well).
Radu. This is the only recording to use a harpsichord exclusively for the continuo (i.e., no organ).
Bruggen. Period instruments, definitely not 1VPP but smallish.
Fasolis. A little fast at times for my taste.
Rene Jacobs.
I like Herreweghe's recordings, but some don't.

And bear in my mind the Suzuki is releasing this one very soon and has all the potential to be great.

If you have any specific questions, or want to elaborate on your tastes, I might be able to narrow this down a bit, or add some other recommendations.

[knight66]

I also own the Parrott and it is not one to a part. I know nothing of the recording you describe by Rifkin, but I have in front of me the recording I described. So, I can only assume he recorded it more than once. However, you are correct that the one-per-part does not have Emma Kirkby in it. It has Judith Nelson, Julianne Baird, Jeffrey Dooley, Frank Hoffmeister, Jan Opalach and three other singers for when the parts divide.

I did not dream the recording. It is on Nonsuch Ultima I don't know whether it is currently available, but I have seen it in shops as recently as about six months ago.

As to the Parrott, I like it a great deal, the et Resurrexit is the most exuberant version that I know of.

Mike

[prémont]

I know nothing of the recording you describe by Rifkin, but I have in front of me the recording I described. So, I can only assume he recorded it more than once. However, you are correct that the one-per-part does not have Emma Kirkby in it. It has Judith Nelson, Julianne Baird, Jeffrey Dooley, Frank Hoffmeister, Jan Opalach and three other singers for when the parts divide.

This is in all probability the same recording as the Erato issue (licenced I suppose), the names of the singers being identical.

[KevinP]

First of all, you say you didn't dream the recording and I completely believe you. At this point, I'm just trying to figure out what recordings we're talking about. If Emmy Kirkby isn't on the 1VPP, as you say in your second post, then why are we assuming there are two recordings of the Rifkin?

I think I may have the same one as you: on Nonesuch, the cover showing a faded score surrounded by a green border?

[knight66]

Well, Kevin, my cover is different, but if you have the same singers as I listed, then it is the same recording.

Now, has anyone anything to say about the performance?

Mike