Rudolf Serkin

[Bogey]

That looks very cool, I will have to check it out. How are the transfers? Decent amount of noise?

On mine... the LvB is very rough.  The Mozart a bit better.

Is the GPOTC still in print?

[George]

On mine... the LvB is very rough.  The Mozart a bit better.

Is the GPOTC still in print?

When you say rough, do you mean noisy, like Pearl?

The GPOTC is not in print. None of them are. 

[Bogey]

Makes Pearl sound pretty clean. 

At least the No. 23/1936 is still available on the two disc set on the other page.  One would really have to want it though.  Do you have the GPOTC recording?

[Bogey]

Just noticed at the end of the live Serkin recording the radio broadcaster comes on during the applause and closes the show.  Neat stuff.

[George]

Makes Pearl sound pretty clean. 

At least the No. 23/1936 is still available on the two disc set on the other page.  On would really have to want it though.  Do you have the GPOTC recording?

I don't, but it's gettable. 

[Holden]

I've just bought this and am really enjoying what I am hearing which brings me to the next point. Which of his other LvB sonatas would you recommend? I know that George has discussed this at the beginning of this thread but what should I do from here - get Op 106 and 110? Are these his best versions of 8, 14 and 23 or are the later stereo versions in CD below better?


Come in George, Todd, et al

[Todd]

what should I do from here - get Op 106 and 110? Are these his best versions of 8, 14 and 23 or are the later stereo versions in CD below better?

Do get his 106; it is one of the supreme versions out there to my ears.  In general, earlier Serkin is better than later Serkin, but there are exceptions, and pretty much all are woth hearing.

[Oldnslow]

Let's not forget Serkins'  Brahms piano concertos with Szell--both wonderful, as is his earlier Brahms 2nd with Ormandy.

[Mandryka]

Anyone here know this biography -- and the recording of Medelssohn, Bach and Chopin Op 25 Etudes which comes with it?


http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2003/Nov03/serkinbook.jpg

The recordings I value most are probably all chamber music - the Brahms with the Busch Brothers especially, bur also the second Schubert trio and the Beethoven violin sonatas.

The Schumann trio with Casals at the  Malboro Festival didn't seem to be quite as interesting: maybe I should listen again.

Some of the Mozart concertos are fine too -- the 19 with Abaddo and the 14 with the Busch Chamber players. T

[Bogey]

Anyone here know this biography -- and the recording of Medelssohn, Bach and Chopin Op 25 Etudes which comes with it?


http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2003/Nov03/serkinbook.jpg

The recordings I value most are probably all chamber music - the Brahms with the Busch Brothers especially.

I have these two....anything I am missing M?

 
Sonatas in G major Op. 78 & A major Op. 100;
Hungarian Dances Nos. 2, 5 & 20 (Bruno Seidler-Winkler on these)


Quintet in F

I know I am missing some works in this Brahms/Busch/Serkin category, but the Pearls are crazy prices....suggested altenatives

[Mandryka]

I like the  Horn Trio with Brain and the A major Piano Quartet with Bros.  Busch.

I haven't played the Clarinet sonatas with Kell and the Violin Sonatas with Busch for years, but I used to enjoy them, especially the violin sonatas.

[George]

I've just bought this and am really enjoying what I am hearing which brings me to the next point. Which of his other LvB sonatas would you recommend? I know that George has discussed this at the beginning of this thread but what should I do from here - get Op 106 and 110? Are these his best versions of 8, 14 and 23 or are the later stereo versions in CD below better?


Come in George, Todd, et al

His best are the mono recordings. The single SONY CD has many of the performances you have in that Music and Arts set, but in better sound. The 1960 Op. 110 is the best i have heard for that work, it's included in the 3 CD set "The Unreleased Studio Recordings." The rest are good, but the ones I mentioned are the cream of the crop IMO. I would avoid the late recordings on DG. 

[Bogey]

Anyone here know this biography -- and the recording of Medelssohn, Bach and Chopin Op 25 Etudes which comes with it?


http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2003/Nov03/serkinbook.jpg

The recordings I value most are probably all chamber music - the Brahms with the Busch Brothers especially, bur also the second Schubert trio and the Beethoven violin sonatas.

The Schumann trio with Casals at the  Malboro Festival didn't seem to be quite as interesting: maybe I should listen again.

Some of the Mozart concertos are fine too -- the 19 with Abaddo and the 14 with the Busch Chamber players. T

Need to send you a PM, can you empty part of your mailbox?

[Mandryka]

There's a Beethoven PC4 with Toscanini which is recorded on dog biscuits, but you can hear enough if you've got the knack of listening to old records. Anyway -- I found it for download easily enough and I think it is really very good indeed -- one of my favourite recordings of that concerto in fact.

[George]

There's a Beethoven PC4 with Toscanini which is recorded on dog biscuits, but you can hear enough if you've got the knack of listening to old records. Anyway -- I found it for download easily enough and I think it is really very good indeed -- one of my favourite recordings of that concerto in fact.

Early (mono) Serkin is killer.

[Bogey]

Early (mono) Serkin is killer.

Speaking of killer....it looks like one of your early images in this thread got axed, buddy.  Could you redo it, as I have used your posts for reference.

PS Mandyka, thanks for the Chopin hits.

[George]

Speaking of killer....it looks like one of your early images in this thread got axed, buddy.  Could you redo it, as I have used your posts for reference.

Which post? The first post looks fine to me. 

[Bogey]

Which post? The first post looks fine to me. 

The later performances on this live DG CD one is not coming through at this end.....maybe just me?

[George]

The later performances on this live DG CD one is not coming through at this end.....maybe just me?

That's good. You don't want that set. 

OK, I'll fix it.

EDIT - Couldn't modify, so I reposted it below.

[George]

Rudolf Serkin's Beethoven - Because Serkin's Beethoven sonata performances are spread out over a number of different labels and at different points in his career, I have attempted to summarize and comment on these various releases. A few have been left out (on Pearl, Aura, etc), only because I haven't heard them yet, but if I can get a copy of these, I will add them to this review.


This 5CD set on Columbia Legends contains all of Serkin's stereo Beethoven recordings for Sony, compiling the three releases pictured above it, except for the Fantasy from the Essential Classics CD and the 1960 Op. 110 from the "Unreleased Box." The 5CD has a later recording of Op. 110, from 1971. Much of this 5CD set is simply OK. This includes Op. 26, 31/1, 57, 78, 81a, 101 and 110. In these sonatas, his technical ability was either beginning to decline or had already declined. As for the better performances, I thought that the Op. 111 was far and away the best of the lot. His Serkinian power and solidity in the first movement led to a tender and profound second movement. The Moonlight, which also can be found coupled with his Appassionata, Pathetique and Les Adieux on a single disc was excellent. I thought the Op. 109, 22, 13, 10/2 and Hammerklavier were also excellent. I don't think I've heard anyone generate the wall of sound that Serkin creates at the start of his Hammerklavier. I was simply awestruck! This one is also available as a single disc (used) on Sony Essential Classics. His Op. 2/1 and 27/1 were not quite as good, but still recommendable and enjoyable. So overall, more strengths than weaknesses IMO, so I recommend the set as a whole. These recordings were made between 1962 and 1977. Luckily, many of them are available at an earlier point in his career when he was at his peak.

For example, Op. 78 and 81a are available on a 2CD set by Music and Arts. These two performances are excellent and come coupled with the best Waldstein I have ever heard. The sound is certainly not as good as the Sony set, but with performances like these, one easy forgets the sound. The main redeeming feature of this set is the best Waldstein ever recorded, IMO. The Op. 110 in the 5CD set is eclipsed by his other stereo recording from 1960.

This 1960 Op. 110 is contained in this Sony 3CD set. Why Sony chose to include the later one in the 5CD set is beyond me. Unfortunately the only way to get this incredible performance is to buy the 3CD set, even though doing so results in duplicating much of the 5CD set. Nice move, Sony! Although only 11 years separate these 2 performances of Op. 110, the difference is like night and day! The 1960 performance is much better recorded and performed. The sound is warmer and more suitable to this sonata. The central movement has great power and rhythmic drive and elsewhere he has an uncharacteristic gentleness and depth of feeling that makes for a superb reading. The 1971 has much drier sound and little of the other redeeming qualities of the 1960 version. I think it was a terrible mistake for Sony to only include the 1960 finale in the 5CD set. At the least, they should have discarded the 1971 performance in favor of the 1960. Even stranger is the fact that Serkin himself did not approve of the 1960 performance for release.

The Op. 57 from the M&A set is also bettered in mono sound, this time here on this Sony CD. The remainder of this disc (in mono sound) is also excellent and deserves an unqualified recommendation. All of the performances better his later stereo recordings IMO. The transfers are better here than the M&A set, so the duplicated performances didn't bother me at all. 

The later performances on this live DG CD, are all bettered by earlier performances in his discography. It may be of interest to admirers of the pianist, but not a wise place to begin if just starting out.     

If you are just beginning to collect Serkin's Beethoven, I suggest starting with the mono Sony and/or Music and Arts discs, as the performances are all excellent on these discs. The Sony has better transfers but the M&A has that stellar Waldstein. When I last checked, the M&A is available through Archiv Music. Then, if more is desired, the above 5CD Sony set is not too big an investment. However, I would not be without the 3CD set, for it has that incredible Op. 110 that is unique to that release. My experience with Serkin's Beethoven has shown me that his earlier performances are the ones to have.