Jazz recordings you are considering

[king ubu]

I know stuff like this is on a public-domain label (Solar), and sound quality can be an issue, but are alternative sources even available for some of these live dates? Many are billed as first CD releases. I am checking on these issues where possible, even finding spare tracks online, to test sound before investing.

Not for these - you can go into bit-torrent or trading of FLAC alternatively, but if you prefer CDs, you have to buy these, I guess (I think the Manchester Messengers might have been on a previous similar release).

Honestly though: in both these cases I'd tend to only recommend these once you have just about everything official from Blakey up to 1965 and everything official (plus [semi?-]official live recordings such as the Copenhagen on Storyville, much of the Monk family stuff released on Joel Dorn's labels and explore records etc.).

Not saying these aren't worth it, but the 1961 Messengers recorded half a dozen of great albums, as well as double live album that's really quite great (can't find the proper RVG Edition 2CD reissue on amazon.com, it's likely OOP anyway):



Re: Monk, depending on your likings, live recordings might indeed be more fun, but there's a Columbia box now, and as I mentioned, there's official or semi-official stuff around. There's also some good stuff by the 1967 large band tour of Europe with Johnny Griffin, Clark Terry, Ray Copeland, Jimmy Cleveland, Phil Woods added to the quartet (with Rouse, Gales, Riley) - those recordings are really good additions to the official catalogue as that band went undocumented other than a couple of tracks (sans Terry) on the "Straight No Chaser" soundtrack (these are also on the quite nice three disc overview of Monk's Columbia years that does contain several rarities for the die-hard Monk fan).

[Brian]

King Ubu or anyone else, what artists & albums should I explore next if I love the two Columbia albums with George Benson, Lonnie Smith, & Ronnie Cuber (It's Uptown and Cookbook)? Don't know any of Smith's solo work, or Brother Jack, so it feels like those are the logical next step? Looking for a similar feel in the jazz-soul borderland. I also associate early Benson with a youthful optimism and upbeat charm.

[king ubu]

King Ubu or anyone else, what artists & albums should I explore next if I love the two Columbia albums with George Benson, Lonnie Smith, & Ronnie Cuber (It's Uptown and Cookbook)? Don't know any of Smith's solo work, or Brother Jack, so it feels like those are the logical next step? Looking for a similar feel in the jazz-soul borderland. I also associate early Benson with a youthful optimism and upbeat charm.

I'm not too big on Benson, honestly ... there's an album of his with McDuff's band - one album his, one McDuff's with Benson on guitar.
http://www.allmusic.com/album/the-new-boss-guitar-of-george-benson-mw0000690477
Full disclosure: that Benson album is also found on this more recent twofer:
http://www.allmusic.com/album/george-benson-jack-mcduff-mw0000584878
But the *other* album on that twofer is found on yet another great McDuff twofer, so get this one and the Benson single (or the twofer if it's cheaper or easier to find, which might be the case):
http://www.allmusic.com/album/brother-jack-mcduff-live!-mw0000628223

Jack McDuff on the other hand ... totally different story, terrific musician! He made his quartets (that's what he usually led: ts, g, org, d) sound like whole orchestras, with the arrangements and the band's sound tightly knit and thought out in a great way that never makes the band sound contained or restrained.

McDuff had his share of great sidemen, notably Grant Green, but also lesser known (but very good) guys such as Harold Vick or Red Holloway. In Joe Dukes he had an amazing drummer who really helped producing that "band sound" (and propelling the band, bigtime). He also got his own album, which can be found on this fine twofer:
http://www.allmusic.com/album/soulful-drums-2001-mw0000588209
All of this is with the core group of that time: Holloway, Benson, McDuff, Dukes (both the "Live!" and the "Soulful Drums" twofers I mean).

Regarding single albums reissued as standalones, "The Honeydripper" is highly recommended (there's an RVG Remaster edition), same goes for the album co-led with Gene Ammons ("Brother Jack Meets the Boss") and the one with Sonny Stitt ("Sonny Stitt Meets Brother Jack", with the underrated Eddie Diehl on guitar). Then there's the meeting with Roland Kirk, again pretty good ("Kirk's Work").

The Legends of Acid Jazz twofers are mighty fine as well. "Glide On" with Bill Jennings (and no horns) has an after hours feeling to it that I love, but it's so laid back some might find it a bit on the boring side.

McDuff's not subtitled "Legends of Acid Jazz" twofer has more fine music from the group with Benson, but it's the other one I'd particularly recommend, "Legends of Acid Jazz: Brother Jack": the album with Vick, Green and Dukes is amongst McDuff's finest.

If you turn into a McDuff completist, be aware that the series of Prestige/Fantasy twofers and compilations contains almost his complete Prestige recordings (I think just a few titles are absent), but lots of it reshuffeled, sometimes in an order that makes sense, sometimes less so ... such twofers/compilations are "Prelude", "Concert McDuff", "The Last Good'un" and "Silken Soul".

More notes:

"Crash" is a twofer with albums by McDuff/Kenny Burrell ... and while I consider Burrell one of my favourite jazz guitarists (next to Grant Green and some of the cooler school), the match is somewhat less exciting than with Green and Benson (Burrell worked best with Jimmy Smith though, whose one encounter with Green is somewhat underwhelming).

"Soul Summit" is another twofer ... too many stars, not quite enough coherence - for completists only I'd say.

single albums reissued that I'd not consider at the very top (but none of them is bad): "Brother Jack", "Tough Duff" and "Screamin'" (the later has Leo Wright on alto sax - an acquired taste for some, and a musician sounding somewhat shrill if not out of tune to many others, so beware if you don't know him ... one sort of sub-radar second row essential he's one is Johnny Coles' lone Blue Note outing "Little Johnny C", which is pretty nice with its Duke Pearson arrangements for a three-horn-frontline, none other than Joe Henderson being third)


As for McDuff on other labels, I'm afraid with him, I prefer the "pure" productions of Prestige. His Atlantic albums are good fun, the one with Fathead ("Double Barelled Soul") holds the most attraction for me.

The Blue Notes are fun, and I guess I might not quite *get* "Moon Rappin'" yet, but "Down Home Style" has a nice cover of course.


This got long ... but I really love McDuff! Bundling, I'd say, get:

- Live! (for Benson, or rather the Holloway/Benson/Dukes band)
- Legends of Acid Jazz: Brother Jack (for the Vick/Green/Dukes album - the one on the twofer is fine, too!)
- The Honeydripper (for it being a classic)

and then go from there 

[Brian]

Thanks so much for this guide!
I'm really digging that quartet formation (ts, g, org, d) so I just ordered the "Brother Jack Live!" twofer and wishlisted your other recommendations, including the Gene Ammons collaboration. Also appreciate the warning about Screamin'. I will look up Leo Wright on YouTube just to get a taste of that style.

Honestly I think my favorite thing about Benson is his exuberance when singing, and the way he sounds like he is constantly delighted with even the cheesiest song lyrics. He certainly doesn't sing "straight" like a Joe Williams - lots more vocal styling, tricks, ornamentation, but in a way that I enjoy.

[king ubu]

Thanks so much for this guide!
I'm really digging that quartet formation (ts, g, org, d) so I just ordered the "Brother Jack Live!" twofer and wishlisted your other recommendations, including the Gene Ammons collaboration.

Anytime, when I can

Also appreciate the warning about Screamin'. I will look up Leo Wright on YouTube just to get a taste of that style.

Wise decision, but as I said, he's on that really nice Johnny Coles album, so you could also just order that one 
Actually he's on quite a few nice similar under-the-radar albums such as Richard Williams' lone album as a leader ("New Horn in Town" on Candid, Williams played with Mingus, the Jones/Lewis Big Band and many others and co-led a band with Gigi Gryce that recorded several albums, mainly three very good ones on Prestige/New Jazz) ... and Wright has his own album on Atlantic, "Blues Shout", with Richard Williams and violin player Harry Lookofsky amongst others, that's a really interesting one actually, reissued on a CD twofer by Collectables (and elsewhere I assume) also containing an album by Hank Crawford (if you enjoy easy-going funky jazz, note his "More Soul", also on Atlantic - that's Ray Charles' band without the leader, and what a great band that was! (If you're a CD buyer, the Atlantic Jazz Masters reissue is the one to get: https://www.discogs.com/de/Hank-Crawford-More-Soul/release/5329265)

Honestly I think my favorite thing about Benson is his exuberance when singing, and the way he sounds like he is constantly delighted with even the cheesiest song lyrics. He certainly doesn't sing "straight" like a Joe Williams - lots more vocal styling, tricks, ornamentation, but in a way that I enjoy.

Hm, I love Joe Williams and a few other singers (Andy Bey, Hoagy Carmichael, Jimmy Rushing) but usually don't really look for male jazz singers ... but I guess I should give Benson another try some day. He's actually a pretty fine guitar player as those records with McDuff's band amply proof (not sure he still is, the kind of stuff he or someone like Hugh Masekela - who's early stuff I love - does nowadays has me heading in the opposite direction).

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

[HIPster]

Impulse! 25 CD set to be released:

http://www.udiscovermusic.com/discover-your-impulsive-side-with-this-25-cd-box-set

[Brian]

Impulse! 25 CD set to be released:

http://www.udiscovermusic.com/discover-your-impulsive-side-with-this-25-cd-box-set

Hmmm. I only own 1 (grey market, though), 8, and 13, so this may well be worth it for me. Never even heard of the artists on #21-24.

[North Star]

Hmmm. I only own 1 (grey market, though), 8, and 13, so this may well be worth it for me. Never even heard of the artists on #21-24.

Never heard of Alice Coltrane? I suspect you've heard of her husband... The album in the box is a classic, and rather easier listening than the later works of her husband. There's a fair bit of Indian influence, and a tamboura and an oud are featured.

Haden played bass in Ornette Coleman's band, don't know much more about him.

[kishnevi]

Never heard of Alice Coltrane? I suspect you've heard of her husband... The album in the box is a classic, and rather easier listening than the later works of her husband. There's a fair bit of Indian influence, and a tamboura and an oud are featured.

Haden played bass in Ornette Coleman's band, don't know much more about him.

I think Haden passed away within the last year.  He partnered with Jarrett on some ECM recordings of recent vintage.

[king ubu]

Excellent music ... probably in less than ideal but acceptable sound - European PD release, perfectly legal, but as usual you don't know the sources (and what they do with them). Though from that bunch, Fresh Sound is certainly one of the more thorough and generally rather reliable labels.

"Cookin'" was on Savoy initially, and it's too bad those Denon/Savoy reissues from the late 80s (sloppy editing wrt to covers/info - some mistakes in line-ups etc., but good sound) are pretty rare. "That's It" was on Candid and an official reissue straight from Candid should be around. Those two are amongst his best, the Candid maybe having the edge (though the Savoy adds Richard Williams, whom I always enjoy hearing). The third one, "The Book Cooks", is somewhat less essential. It was released on Bethlehem, had some CD reissues, but I have no idea how many and how obtainable they are (I have the Avenue Jazz/Rhino one). It pairs Ervin with Zoot Sims (a nice but somewhat odd idea, I think), adds another unsung trumpet player (Tommy Turrentine), and has the smoother, more elegant Tommy Flanagan on piano and the some much less smooth Dannie Richmond on drums, while retaining the bass player of the Parlan/Tucker/Harewood trio that worked so well together with both Booker as well as with Stanley & Tommy Turrentine. A fine bunch of albums, no doubt. My Ervin top (as a leader) would probably read like this: The Freedom Book, The Space Book, That's It. The first two of those have his *other* congenial piano accompanist, Jaki Byard, the amazing Richard Davis on bass, and Alan Dawson on drums. I don't think Ervin made a bad album, not even a bad song ... but there's some truth to the statement that he always plays the same solo. I don't care, as I love the energy and conviction that's always there as soon as he starts playing. Obviously, he learnt a lot while with Mingus. "Mingus in Wonderland" displays him alongside John Handy and is burning hot, but he's on a few other classic Mingus albums, of course! And he's brilliant on Randy Weston's Monterey 1966 concert, released on Verve/PolyGram/Gitanes/whatever.

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

Thanks for the detailed reply. How did you learn so much about jazz?

Here is another very beautiful one I just heard last night on Rise:



And this too, especially the track "Sophisticated Lady" sung by Jeanne Lee:

[king ubu]

Thanks for the detailed reply. How did you learn so much about jazz?

A lot is just ... opinion, though I am most often happy to give reasons and provide explanations.

I started avidly listening (and collecting) at around 15, my parents have a broad range of LPs and CDs, music was always around (including two favourites of theirs, "African Marketplace" by Dollar Brand and "Amandla" by Miles Davis - I heard both so often as a kid that I know them by heart, really ...  same btw for the Prey/Orfeo recording of Brahms/Tieck's "Die schöne Magelone").

But it quickly grew into almost an obsession and went far beyond what my parents were able to pass on (they always encouraged my curiosity and I will be thankful for that always). So I started reading some books (chiefly JE Berendt's "Das Jazz-Buch", still one of the best books in German if you want to get an overview, though I don't know if some of the sorta Hegelian models of progress/development of my late 80s edition were gotten rid of in later editions, hopefully so!).

Other than that, once I got online at the end of the 90s, I started frequenting some jazz boards with lots of activity and plenty of older knowledgeable folks around were I picked up lots of recommendations that often went beyond the obvious and into the obscure. Some of those discussions also were elemental in how I learnt thinking about music (and arts in general).

Then I went on to study history (plus German literature and philosophy as minors), so the painstakingly exact (self-)education went to the next level ... and the main thing was: I always got immense pleasure out of it, even if I know it's nothing that can be put to real use in our capitalist system ...

One other thing I got from home: playing an instrument (and persevering). After several years of dreadful recorder lessons (as I name-dropped Hegel, the teacher's name was Marx), I switched to clarinet, and halfway through high school to tenor saxophone. But I never reached any really good level as an improviser, remaining more a guts player, eventually experimenting with free improv, too ... but that stopped a while ago (and the actual alternative to history would have been to attend conservatory on clarinet ... not to be mistaken as an anti-intellectual stance [that's mostly a bad excuse for laziness and discrimination anyway], but I don't quite embrace those schools that pretend to teach jazz ... they teach technical proficiency and a subset of common performance practises but jazz is so much more ... and eventually music prove too dear to my heart to make it my profession - so there's my reply to that other very interesting thread).

Bottom line: more than 20 years of passionate listening, discussing, reading, and sometimes writing.

And that, too, explains why I am kinda shy around here, as it never quite feels right to discuss classical music in that same manner, though I really try hard to do some catching up!

Sorry to digress for so long 

(edited for smartphone induced typos)

[king ubu]

No idea if there's interest, but ...

JPC has nice prices on some of the Storyville boxes - these go for 35€ currently, and at least the Duke Ellington set ist easily recommended, with the (sonically amazing) Fargo set, it contains a most important bit of Ellingtonia:

The Duke Box

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/jazz/detail/-/art/Duke-Ellington-1899-1974-The-Duke-Box/hnum/8707288

The Blues Box

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/poprock/detail/-/art/The-Blues-Box-7CD-DVD/hnum/5557134

The Armstrong Box

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/jazz/detail/-/art/Louis-Armstrong-1901-1971-The-Armstrong-Box-7-CD-DVD/hnum/9912297

George Lewis - Keeper of the Flame

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/jazz/detail/-/art/George-Lewis-Keeper-Of-The-Flame/hnum/4080235

Billy Strayhorn - Out of the Shadows

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/jazz/detail/-/art/billy-strayhorn-out-of-the-shadows/hnum/5247145



The recent Earl Hines goes for €43:

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/jazz/detail/-/art/earl-hines-piano-genius-at-work/hnum/8602936

[Spineur]

Hi !  I have been listening to some Till  Brönner on the radio and on YT and found it quite appealing to the point of thinking to purchase one or two albums.  He has done quite a few, most of them being well recieved.
At this stage, I would gladly take some advice from the GMG jazz crowd.

[king ubu]

Frank reply: skip it, forget it ... he is present on silly talent tv shows and stuff, more like a model/actor than a jazz musician (and that includes when he's playing jazz). Though he definitely has chops, that's quite clear. The one fond memory I have is of him playing a set in trio (with Johan Leijonhufvud on guitar and Dieter Ilg on bass if memory doesn't play any tricks on me - not familiar with Leijonhufvud otherwise) at the Zurich "jazznojazz" festival and I heard that on the radio ... seemed pretty good indeed. But in general, he's too much façade, too much smart guy, too much marketing for my liking.

May be I'm unfair there and should judge the music on its own merits and solely on that ... but there's so much music to choose from - ars longa, vita brevis and all that 

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

Anyone heard this? I have Sorey's beautiful CD Alloy, but was rather blown away by this when I heard it on KCSM a few nights ago.

[king ubu]

Have it on the piles, actually wanted to play it earlier today but was derailed and went on with other things ... I think it's a kind of ambitious, composed project, but I guess you're aware of those details and the line-up etc. A friend of mine who's a big fan of Sorey's likes it a lot, whatever that is worth.

[king ubu]

Alright, the Tyshawn Sorey made it to the player today - first impression: this is brooding chamber jazz, melodic, melancholic, long-form, slowly evolving ... I liked it a lot!

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

Cool. Do you have Alloy? Alloy is largely similar--subdued, introspective, minimalist--a long drawn out meditation in Feldmanesque style.